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Avodah Zarah 23a

עבודה זרה כ״ג ע״א

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Topic

רבינא resolves the contradiction about trusting גוים with animals by splitting between לכתחילה and דיעבד. The גמרא tries to prove this split from the case of a woman imprisoned by גוים, but rejects the proof.

Overview

Earlier, the גמרא raised a contradiction. Our משנה suspects גוים of bestiality, yet a ברייתא allows an animal bought from a גוי to be brought as a קרבן. רבינא answers that the משנה is about לכתחילה and the ברייתא is about דיעבד. The גמרא tries to prove this split from a woman imprisoned by גוים. The proof fails, because there the captor holds back only out of fear of losing his ransom money. רבי פדת gives a second answer: the משנה follows רבי אליעזר and the ברייתא follows רבנן. His source is their dispute over buying a פרה אדומה from a גוי. The גמרא tests this proof against other explanations of רבי אליעזר's view. One is that the גוי may have put a load on the cow. Another is the word 'וְיִקְחוּ' in the פסוק, as שֵׁילָא taught. Both are pushed away. The עמוד ends as the גמרא starts one more attempt to limit where the רבנן disagree, and this continues on the next עמוד.

Opening lines

רָבִינָא אָמַר: לָא קַשְׁיָא —

Ravina said: It is not difficult —

הָא לְכַתְּחִלָּה, הָא דִּיעֲבַד.

this one is ab initio, that one is after the fact.

וּמְנָא תֵּימְרָא

And from where do you say

דְּשָׁאנֵי בֵּין לְכַתְּחִלָּה בֵּין לְדִיעֲבַד?

that there is a difference between ab initio and after the fact?

The steps (14)

  1. Resolutionרבינא: one source is before the fact, the other after
  2. QuestionWhere do we see such a distinction?
  3. ProofProof from the woman imprisoned by gentiles
  4. RejectionRejection: the captor fears losing his money
  5. ProofThe end of that משנה confirms the money reason
  6. Resolutionרבי פדת: The Two Sources Follow Different תנאים
  7. ProofProof from the Dispute About Buying a פרה אדומה
  8. RejectionMaybe the Worry Is Work, Not רביעה
  9. RejectionA גוי Would Not Ruin a Big Sale for a Small Convenience
  10. ChallengeThe Same Logic Should Apply to רביעה
  11. ResolutionWith רביעה, His Desire Overpowers Him
  12. RejectionMaybe רבי אליעזר learns his rule from the word 'take'
  13. RejectionThe word 'take' cannot explain all offerings
  14. RejectionMaybe the רבנן argue with רבי אליעזר only in some cases