Bava Basra 127a

בבא בתרא קכ״ז ע״א

Bava Batra 127a

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Topic

A טומטום found to be male and laws tied to birth; doubtful firstborns and the הרשאה between them

Overview

This amud continues the discussion of a טומטום who is later found to be a זכר. אמימר says he does not reduce the בכור's extra share. רב שיזבי says he is not circumcised on the eighth day. רב שרביא says his mother is not טמאה לידה, because the פסוק requires a known זכר from birth. A משנה says a woman who miscarries a טומטום keeps the rules of both a male and a female birth. This conclusively refutes רב שרביא. The גמרא tries to save רב שיזבי by saying the משנה was ruling strictly out of doubt, but that answer ends with an unanswered difficulty. רבא then brings a ברייתא supporting רבי אמי: a טומטום and a doubtful בכור get no double share. This leads to רבא publicly taking back his ruling about two sons born in hiding, in favor of רבי ינאי's rule. Finally, the people of אקרא דאגמא ask שמואל what happens when a father names a different son as בכור than the one everyone presumed, and his answer begins here and continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

The steps (16)

1. StatementA טומטום found male does not reduce the firstborn's extra portion
2. StatementA טומטום found male is not circumcised on the eighth day
3. StatementHis mother is not impure from the birth
4. ChallengeA משנה says the mother of a טומטום keeps both sets of rules
5. ConclusionThe refutation stands
6. ChallengeIs רב שיזבי refuted too?
7. ResolutionThe תנא was only in doubt and ruled strictly
8. ChallengeIf it's a doubt, the משנה should add נדה
9. ConclusionThe challenge stands
10. ProofA ברייתא supports רבי אמי on the בכור's share
11. QuestionWhat does excluding a doubtful firstborn come to teach?
12. ResponseIt rejects רבא's ruling about two sons born in hiding
13. Challengeרב פפא challenges רבא with רבין's letter
14. Conclusionרבא publicly admits his mistake
15. Questionבני אקרא דאגמא ask שמואל about a father contradicting a presumption
16. Responseשמואל answers that the sons write an authorization