Gemara Clarity

Bava Kamma 23b

בבא קמא כ״ג ע״ב

Learn Bava Kamma 23b step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

Open Bava Kamma 23b in Gemara Clarity

Topic

Whether an animal's mouth counts like the owner's courtyard, fencing against grazing animals, and how an ox becomes a מועד

Overview

The גמרא learns from the case of a dog that ate bread that an animal's mouth counts like the injured party's courtyard. This matters because there was an open question: is a cow's mouth (פי פרה) like the injured party's courtyard or like the owner's? It attacks the 'owner's courtyard' side by asking when anyone would ever pay for שן. רב מרי answers with damage done for pleasure without the mouth. רבינא and רב אשי defend him against מר זוטרא's demand for total destruction. Proofs from a dog or snake set on a person are pushed off, because the argument 'what were you doing in my area?' does not apply where someone was killed. A ברייתא about an ox that kills a trespasser shows this. Then a story about goats that damaged רב יוסף's property teaches that a landowner is expected to fence his field. A public ruling adds that owners of damaging market goats are warned and then made to slaughter them. Finally a new משנה gives the מחלוקת between רבי יהודה and רבי מאיר on how an ox becomes a מועד. The גמרא brings the פסוק-based sources of אביי and רבא for רבי יהודה, and begins quoting רבי מאיר's source, which continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

כַּחֲצַר הַנִּיזָּק דָּמֵי;

is like the courtyard of the injured party;

דְּאִי כַּחֲצַר הַמַּזִּיק דָּמֵי,

for if it were like the courtyard of the one who caused the damage,

לֵימָא לֵיהּ:

let him say to him:

מַאי בָּעֵי רִפְתָּךְ בְּפוּמָּא דְּכַלְבַּאי?

What is your bread doing in my dog's mouth?

The steps (27)

  1. ProofThe dog's mouth counts like the injured party's courtyard
  2. QuestionThe open question about a cow's mouth
  3. ChallengeIf the mouth is the owner's space, when would שן ever apply?
  4. Resolutionרב מרי: שן without the mouth
  5. Challengeמר זוטרא: שן Must Destroy Completely
  6. Resolutionרבינא and רב אשי Show Total Destruction
  7. ProofProof from Inciting a Dog
  8. RejectionTwo Ways to Reject the Dog Proof
  9. ProofNew Source: Making a Snake Bite
  10. Statementרב אחא בר יעקב explains the snake dispute
  11. ProofIf the mouth were like the owner's courtyard, the owner could object
  12. RejectionThat argument is not used where someone was killed
  13. ProofSource: an ox kills a trespasser
  14. QuestionWhy the owner pays no ransom
  15. ChallengeThen the ox should be spared too
  16. ConclusionConclusion: the argument does not apply to killing
  17. StatementGoats damage רב יוסף's property
  18. Responseאביי says the owners will tell him to build a fence
  19. ChallengeThen when is the owner ever liable for eating damage?
  20. ResolutionCases where a fenced field is still damaged
  21. StatementPublic announcement about damaging market goats
  22. StatementNew משנה: רבי יהודה on how an ox becomes known to gore
  23. Statementרבי מאיר's view of forewarned and innocuous
  24. QuestionWhat is the source for רבי יהודה's three days?
  25. Responseאביי counts each word of the verse
  26. Responseרבא reads the verse with fewer counts
  27. QuestionWhat is the source for רבי מאיר?