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Bava Metzia 72b

בבא מציעא ע״ב ע״ב

Learn Bava Metzia 72b step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

Open Bava Metzia 72b in Gemara Clarity

Topic

Documents that 'should never have been written' (לא ניתן ליכתב), and fixing prices and borrowing produce by the market rate without רבית

Overview

The amud opens at the end of an argument about a sale document. Someone argues that a document the seller admits to should collect from נכסים משועבדים, just like a loan שטר the borrower admits writing. רבא answers that a document only has that power if it records something that was allowed to be written (ניתן ליכתב). רבינא tests this twice: once from רבי יוחנן's rule on a backdated document (שטר מוקדם), and once from a ברייתא about a robber who sold a stolen field. מרימר and the גמרא answer that the backdated document is still good from its true date. They also answer that the robber will make peace with the owner and make his sale document good. A new משנה then teaches that you may not fix a price now for produce delivered later until the market price is out, with exceptions for goods that are almost ready and for manure. The גמרא limits רבי יוחנן's ban to unsteady small-town markets. A ברייתא and רב נחמן discuss separate prices for new and old grain and for gleaners' wheat. רב הונא first forbade borrowing produce based on the market rate, then allowed it after hearing רבי אלעזר. The amud ends by setting up a new ברייתא about buying a traveler's package at the price of the town he is heading to, and its ruling comes on the next amud.

Opening lines

מוֹדֶה בִּשְׁטָר שֶׁכְּתָבוֹ –

One who admits about a document that he wrote it –

אֵינוֹ צָרִיךְ לְקַיְּימוֹ,

the holder does not need to prove it valid in court,

וְגוֹבֶה מִנְּכָסִים מְשׁוּעְבָּדִים.

and he collects from liened properties that were sold.

אֲמַר לֵיהּ רָבָא: מִי דָּמֵי?

Rava said to him: Are these comparable?

The steps (26)

  1. ProofProof from a borrower who admits he wrote the loan document
  2. Rejectionרבא: a real loan document is different from a deal that should never have been written
  3. Challengeרבינא challenges with רבי יוחנן's rule on backdated documents
  4. ResolutionA backdated document is still valid from its true date
  5. ChallengeChallenge from the robber who sold a stolen field
  6. ResolutionThe robber has reasons to make the document work, our seller does not
  7. StatementNo fixing a price for future produce until the market price is known
  8. StatementA seller whose goods are almost ready may fix a price early
  9. StatementFixing a price for manure, and the disagreement of רבי יוסי
  10. StatementLocking in the lowest price, and רבי יהודה's addition
  11. Statementרבי יוחנן: no fixing a price by the market rate
  12. Questionרבי זירא asks: even a big central market?
  13. ResponseOnly small-town markets
  14. ChallengeUnder the first reading, when does the משנה ever apply?
  15. ResolutionThe משנה means wheat from warehouses and ships
  16. Statementברייתא: the seller may fix a price even without produce
  17. StatementNew and old grain at different prices
  18. StatementGleaners' wheat and regular wheat need separate prices
  19. StatementA gleaner may fix a price at the gleaners' rate
  20. ChallengeWhy can't a homeowner also use the gleaners' rate?
  21. ResolutionIt is beneath a homeowner to borrow from a gleaner
  22. ResolutionA buyer from a homeowner pays for good wheat
  23. StatementNo borrowing based on the market rate
  24. ChallengeDid רב הונא really forbid it? The students' case
  25. Resolutionרב הונא changed his mind
  26. StatementA friend offers to buy a traveler's package at the other town's price