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Me’ilah 2b

מעילה ב׳ ע״ב

Meilah 2b

Learn Me’ilah 2b step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

Open Me’ilah 2b in Gemara Clarity

Topic

Must קדשי קדשים slaughtered in the south come down from the מזבח, and is there rabbinic-level מעילה?

Overview

The גמרא asks a new question. Suppose קדשי קדשים were slaughtered in the south instead of the north, and they were already put on the מזבח. Do we take them down? רבה says yes, and רב יוסף says no. The argument is only about the view of רבי שמעון. רבה explains that slaughtering in the south is like strangling the animal, so even רבי שמעון would take it down. The גמרא challenges רבה from a משנה that says there is מעילה on these animals. It answers that this מעילה is only מדרבנן, which means there is no extra חומש payment. It proves from עולא in the name of רבי יוחנן that rabbinic מעילה exists, because dead קדשים still carry it. The גמרא then asks why עולא needed to teach this if a משנה already says it. Its answer begins here and continues on the next עמוד.

Opening lines

אִיבַּעְיָא לְהוּ:

A question was raised before them:

אִי עָלוּ, מַהוּ שֶׁיֵּרְדוּ?

If they went up, what is the law: do they come down?

רַבָּה אָמַר: אִם עָלוּ – יֵרְדוּ,

Rabba says: If they went up, they come down,

רַב יוֹסֵף אָמַר: אִם עָלוּ – לֹא יֵרְדוּ.

Rav Yosef says: If they went up, they do not come down.

The steps (16)

  1. QuestionThe question: if they went up on the altar, do they come down?
  2. Responseרבה and רב יוסף disagree
  3. StatementThe argument is only according to רבי שמעון
  4. Rejectionרב יוסף follows רבי שמעון; רבה limits רבי שמעון's rule
  5. ResolutionSlaughtering in the south is like strangling
  6. ChallengeThe משנה says there is מעילה on offerings slaughtered in the south
  7. ResolutionThe משנה means rabbinic-level מעילה
  8. QuestionWhat is the difference between Torah and rabbinic מעילה?
  9. ResponseOnly Torah מעילה requires paying the extra fifth
  10. ChallengeIs there really such a thing as rabbinic מעילה?
  11. ProofProof from עולא: offerings that died have rabbinic מעילה
  12. ChallengeThen the משנה already teaches what עולא taught
  13. Resolutionעולא was still needed: south-slaughtered animals are a special case
  14. ResolutionDead animals might have been thought to have no מעילה at all
  15. ChallengeA משנה already teaches מעילה for a dead חטאת
  16. ResolutionOpening of the answer: 'You might have thought'