Niddah 13b

נדה י״ג ע״ב

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Topic

Wasting seed and arousal; women and a כהן שוטה who cannot check their own purity (נדה 13b)

Overview

The amud opens by finishing a rule about where a man may hold himself, then speaks strongly about deliberately causing arousal. רב says such a man deserves נידוי, because he stirs up his own יצר הרע. רבי אמי adds that he is called an עבריין, since the יצר הרע leads a person step by step all the way to עבודה זרה. רבי אלעזר and the school of רבי ישמעאל use פסוקים to show how serious wasting seed is. A ברייתא says converts and 'those who play with children' delay the משיח, and the גמרא explains the second group as men who marry girls too young to have children. The גמרא then asks whether the משנה's 'the hand should be cut off' is a real punishment or only a curse. It tries to prove the answer from רבי טרפון, but the proof falls away. A new משנה teaches that capable women may check women who cannot check themselves, and the גמרא clarifies who is on that list. Finally, a ברייתא discusses how a כהן שוטה can stay טהור to eat תרומה, which leads to a discussion of pouches and of trousers, and a new statement of אביי that continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

The steps (38)

1. StatementAbove the corona it is forbidden
2. Statementרב: one who deliberately causes arousal deserves ostracism
3. ChallengeWhy not just say it is forbidden?
4. ResolutionHe stirs up the evil inclination against himself
5. Statementרבי אמי: he is called a transgressor
6. StatementAnother version: he is kept out of God's presence
7. ProofProof from the word 'evil' in two verses
8. Statementרבי אלעזר: 'Your hands are full of blood'
9. ProofSchool of רבי ישמעאל: 'Do not commit adultery' includes this
10. StatementConverts and those who play with children delay the Messiah
11. QuestionConverts are understood, but what is 'playing with children'?
12. RejectionIt cannot mean relations with a male
13. RejectionIt cannot mean emitting seed through other limbs
14. ResponseIt means marrying girls too young to have children
15. ProofThe Messiah waits until all souls are born
16. QuestionIs cutting off the hand a real law or only a curse?
17. Proofרבי טרפון's teaching about cutting off the hand
18. ProofThe split belly only makes sense if it is a real punishment
19. RejectionEven a real punishment would not need to be on the navel
20. ResolutionA new reading of רבי טרפון's words
21. StatementNew משנה: women who cannot check themselves
22. ChallengeWhy can't a deaf woman examine herself?
23. ResolutionThe משנה means a woman who can neither hear nor speak
24. ChallengeWhy can't a blind woman check and show a friend?
25. ResolutionThe blind woman does not belong in the משנה
26. ChallengeIsn't a woman who lost her sanity the same as a שוטה?
27. ResolutionShe lost her sanity because of illness
28. StatementA ברייתא: How a Mentally Incompetent Priest Becomes Pure
29. Statementרבי אליעזר ברבי צדוק suggests a leather pouch
30. ChallengeThe Sages Object: Leather Causes Warmth
31. Challengeרבי אליעזר pushes back: then the שוטה has no fix
32. ResolutionThe Sages Reply: Our Way Works, Yours Can Hide a Tiny Drop
33. StatementA Teaching in the Name of רבי אלעזר: A Metal Pouch
34. StatementThe metal pouch means copper
35. Statementרב פפא: so trousers should be forbidden
36. ChallengeBut the Torah commands trousers for כהנים
37. ResolutionThe כהנים' trousers were built differently
38. Statementאביי begins a new statement