Sanhedrin 68b
סנהדרין ס״ח ע״ב
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Topic
בן סורר ומורה: the age window, the source that a קטן is exempt, and whether a son born to a קטן can qualify
Overview
The משנה teaches that a boy can become a בן סורר ומורה only during a short window. It starts when he shows two hairs, the sign of adulthood, and ends once the lower 'beard' has grown in. The פסוק 'כי יהיה לאיש בן' teaches 'a son, not a daughter' and 'a son, not a man,' and a קטן is exempt because he is not yet obligated in מצוות. The גמרא asks for the source that a קטן is exempt. The question is needed because a בן סורר ומורה is killed על שם סופו, and because 'בן ולא איש' could seem to include a קטן. רב יהודה in the name of רב answers that the פסוק means a son close to the strength of a man. רבי חייא and רב דימי then define exactly which hair growth ends the window. רב חסדא learns from the unusual wording 'לאיש בן' that a son born to a קטן can never be a בן סורר ומורה, and the גמרא concludes that the פסוק teaches both lessons. Finally, the גמרא notes that רבה disagrees, since he holds a קטן cannot father children at all. רבה learns this from a פסוק about stealing from a גר, and that discussion continues on the next amud.
Opening lines
מַתְנִי׳
MISHNA:
בֵּן סוֹרֵר וּמוֹרֶה,
A stubborn and rebellious son:
מֵאֵימָתַי נַעֲשֶׂה בֵּן סוֹרֵר וּמוֹרֶה?
from when does he become a stubborn and rebellious son?
מִשֶּׁיָּבִיא שְׁתֵּי שְׂעָרוֹת,
From when he grows two hairs,
The steps (19)
- StatementThe age window for a rebellious son
- StatementThe verse: a son, not a daughter and not a man
- StatementA minor is exempt
- QuestionWhere do we learn that a minor is exempt?
- ChallengeWhy ask? The משנה already gave the reason
- ChallengeThe Torah never punishes a minor anyway
- ResolutionHe is killed for his future, so maybe even a minor
- ResolutionThe word 'son, not a man' seems to mean a minor
- ResponseThe source: a son close to a man's strength
- StatementDefining the 'lower beard' from the משנה
- Statementרב דימי: around the organ, not the testicles
- Statementרב חסדא: a minor's son is exempt
- ChallengeIsn't this verse already used for רב's teaching?
- ResolutionThe unusual word order teaches רב חסדא's rule
- ChallengeMaybe the whole verse is only for רב חסדא
- ResolutionLearn two lessons from the verse
- Statementרבה disagrees: a minor cannot father children
- QuestionHow can any Jew have no relative?
- ResponseThe verse is about stealing from a convert