Gemara Clarity

Sanhedrin 8b

סנהדרין ח׳ ע״ב

Learn Sanhedrin 8b step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

Open Sanhedrin 8b in Gemara Clarity

Topic

מוציא שם רע: why רבי מאיר says 3 judges and the חכמים say 23, explained by עולא, רבא, אביי, רב פפא and רב אשי

Overview

In the משנה, רבי מאיר says a מוציא שם רע case is judged by three judges, and the חכמים say twenty-three. Earlier, עולא explained that they argue about worrying for לעז (rumors), and רבא said they argue about כבודן של ראשונים (the honor of the first judges). Here the גמרא brings a ברייתא where the חכמים say a money claim needs only three, which fits רבא but seems hard for עולא. רבא himself, with רב חייא בר אבין, defends עולא: the three-judge money case is the father's claim against the husband after the husband's witnesses were proven עדים זוממין, and the 23-judge case is the trial of those witnesses. Then אביי says everyone holds both concerns, and the argument is about a warning given in general terms, matching a ברייתא where רבי יהודה requires naming the exact death. רב פפא offers another case: a woman learned in Torah (חבירה) who was not warned, which ties to the dispute of רבי יוסי בר יהודה and the רבנן. Finally רב אשי begins yet another explanation, which continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

מֵיתִיבִי: וַחֲכָמִים אוֹמְרִים,

They raised an objection: And the Rabbis say,

תְּבָעוֹ מָמוֹן – בִּשְׁלֹשָׁה,

if he sued for money, it is judged by three;

תְּבָעוֹ נְפָשׁוֹת – בְּעֶשְׂרִים וּשְׁלֹשָׁה.

if he sued for a capital case, it is judged by twenty-three.

בִּשְׁלָמָא לְרָבָא,

Granted, according to Rava,

The steps (8)

  1. ChallengeA ברייתא that fits רבא but challenges עולא
  2. Resolutionרבא defends עולא: two separate trials
  3. Resolutionאביי: everyone agrees; the argument is about a general warning
  4. ProofA תנא who fits אביי's case of a general warning
  5. Proofרבי יהודה requires naming the exact death penalty
  6. Resolutionרב פפא: the case is about a Torah-knowledgeable woman
  7. ProofThe source: a learned person needs no warning, says רבי יוסי בר יהודה
  8. Resolutionרב אשי begins a third explanation