Bava Basra 72b

בבא בתרא ע״ב ע״ב

Bava Batra 72b

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Topic

Whether רבי שמעון's view of a stingy consecrator fits a ברייתא about redeeming trees and land, and רב הונא's rulings on items with two legal statuses.

Overview

Just before this, the גמרא said a ברייתא about consecrated trees follows רבי שמעון, who holds that one who consecrates does so stingily (בעין רעה). The amud first answers a problem: רבי שמעון's reason 'since they draw from a consecrated field' sounds generous. The answer is that he was only arguing on the רבנן's terms. Next the גמרא challenges the end of that ברייתא. It brings a ברייתא about a son who bought a field from his father, which seems to show that רבי שמעון goes by the time of redemption. If so, the trees should be redeemed together with their land. רב נחמן בר יצחק answers that in general רבי יהודה and רבי שמעון do not go by the time of פדיון. Their ruling comes from the wording of the פסוק. Then רב הונא teaches that a grafted carob and a sycamore trunk have the status of both a tree and land. He also teaches that a sheaf of two סאה counts as both a sheaf and a heap for the laws of שכחה. Finally, ריש לקיש says that whether these two trees become הקדש with a field depends on the argument between רבי מנחם בר יוסי and the רבנן.

Opening lines

The steps (14)

1. ChallengeThe difficulty from רבי שמעון's own reason
2. Resolutionרבי שמעון was arguing on the Rabbis' terms
3. ChallengeQuoting the end of the ברייתא about trees and land
4. Challengeרבי שמעון goes by the time of redemption
5. ProofThe ברייתא of רבי יהודה and רבי שמעון: consecrated first, father died later
6. Statementרבי מאיר uses the same פסוק for a different case
7. ProofFor רבי יהודה and רבי שמעון, the easy case needs no פסוק
8. ProofTheir real reason: they go by the time of redemption
9. ResolutionTheir ruling comes from a verse, not from the time of redemption
10. ProofReading the extra wording of the verse
11. StatementA grafted carob and a sycamore trunk count as both a tree and land
12. StatementA sheaf of two סאה counts as a sheaf for counting
13. ProofProof from a משנה that the big sheaf counts as a heap
14. Statementריש לקיש links the grafted carob and sycamore trunk to an existing dispute