Chullin 8b

חולין ח׳ ע״ב

Learn Chullin 8b step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

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Topic

Residue from knives and forbidden fats: knives of עבודה זרה and גוים, cleaning a טריפה knife, and keeping meat apart from חלבים

Overview

This amud finishes רב נחמן's case of slaughtering with a knife of עבודה זרה. The גמרא explains that the knife is forbidden but has no residue on it. That works if the knife was only used to cut a branch for the idol, or if it is an old knife heated white-hot. Next, רב says that after slaughtering with a knife of גוים you must peel the meat, and רבה בר בר חנה says rinsing is enough. The גמרא gives two versions of why they argue: the slaughter spot is hot but the סימנים are busy pushing out blood, or the spot is cold but the knife's pressure pushes residue in. רב אחא and רבינא then argue about cleaning a knife used on a טריפה, and the הלכה is that cold water, or even wiping it with a cloth, is enough. רב rules that a butcher needs separate knives and separate rinsing water for meat and חלבים, because of a גזירה, and the requirement itself keeps them from getting mixed up. Finally, אמימר warns not to lay fatty flanks on top of other meat. A new challenge to that rule begins at the end and continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

The steps (26)

1. Resolutionרב נחמן is talking about a new knife
2. ChallengeA new knife should not be forbidden at all
3. ResolutionFirst answer: the knife was used to cut a branch for the idol
4. ResolutionSecond answer: an old knife heated white-hot in fire
5. StatementPeel or rinse after slaughtering with a knife of גוים
6. QuestionSuggestion: they argue about whether the slaughter spot is hot
7. RejectionNo: everyone agrees the spot is hot, but the סימנים are busy pushing out blood
8. RejectionSecond version: the spot is cold, but knife pressure pushes residue in
9. StatementArgument over cleaning a knife used on a טריפה
10. ConclusionThe הלכה: cold water is enough, and wiping works too
11. ChallengeChallenge: every kosher knife should also need hot water
12. ResolutionAnswer: absorption happens only after the animal is already permitted
13. StatementA butcher needs three separate knives
14. ChallengeWhy not use one knife, meat first and then fats?
15. ResolutionA decree in case he cuts in the wrong order
16. ChallengeHe could mix up the two knives too
17. ResolutionRequiring two knives makes him alert
18. StatementTwo water vessels: one for meat, one for fats
19. ChallengeWhy not one vessel, meat first and then fats?
20. ResolutionA decree in case he rinses in the wrong order
21. ChallengeHe could mix up the two vessels too
22. ResolutionRequiring two vessels gives him a clear sign
23. StatementDon't lay the flanks on top of other meat
24. ChallengeThen even flanks in their normal position should be a problem
25. ResolutionA membrane separates the fat from below
26. ChallengeA new challenge begins