Gemara Clarity

Horayos 5b

הוריות ה׳ ע״ב

Horayot 5b

Learn Horayos 5b step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

Open Horayos 5b in Gemara Clarity

Topic

Sources for the communal offering, the role of one tribe according to רבי יהודה and רבי שמעון, why one tribe counts as a קהל, and the חטאת of the לוים

Overview

The גמרא first finds the source for רבי מאיר and רבי שמעון's rule that the ruling comes from the בית דין and the action from the people. אביי and רבא each bring a פסוק, and both פסוקים turn out to be needed. A גזרה שוה of the word מעיני carries the rule from עבודה זרה to all sins. Next the גמרא asks, in רבי יהודה's view, whether the other tribes bring offerings when one tribe sinned by a ruling of the בית דין הגדול. After one proof is pushed away, a ברייתא and the wording of the משנה show that they do. A similar question about רבי שמעון is answered from the חכמים of the משנה: one tribe that followed the בית דין הגדול does bring a קרבן. The גמרא then looks for the source that one tribe is called a קהל, and settles on the promise to יעקב before בנימין was born. Finally it begins a ברייתא of רבי שמעון about the חטאת of the לוים, which is compared to the עולה and not eaten. That teaching continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

וְרַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן וְרַבִּי מֵאִיר,

And Rabbi Shimon and Rabbi Meir,

דְּהוֹרָאָה תְּלוּיָה בְּבֵית דִּין

who hold that the ruling depends on the court

וּמַעֲשֶׂה תָּלוּי בַּקָּהָל,

and the action depends on the congregation,

מְנָא לְהוּ?

from where do they learn this?

The steps (33)

  1. QuestionWhat is the source for 'ruling by the court, action by the people'?
  2. Responseאביי's source: 'from the eyes of the congregation'
  3. Responseרבא's source: 'for all the people unwittingly'
  4. StatementWhy both פסוקים are needed
  5. ChallengeThese פסוקים are about idol worship
  6. ResolutionA גזרה שוה: 'from the eyes' and 'from the eyes'
  7. StatementQuoting the משנה about one tribe's court
  8. QuestionOne tribe sinned by the בית דין הגדול's ruling: do the others bring?
  9. QuestionThe two sides of the question
  10. ProofA first proof from a ברייתא: one bull or two bulls
  11. ProofThe first opinion must be רבי יהודה, so only one bull is brought
  12. RejectionRejecting the proof: the case may be six tribes who are a majority
  13. ProofA clear ברייתא in רבי יהודה's name
  14. ConclusionConclusion: the other tribes are liable too
  15. Proofרב אשי brings support from the wording of the משנה
  16. QuestionWhy does the משנה need to say the other tribes are exempt?
  17. ResponseThe extra words teach a difference between the two courts
  18. ConclusionThe proof from the משנה stands
  19. QuestionDoes one tribe bring an offering according to רבי שמעון?
  20. ProofA proof from the one-bull and two-bulls ברייתא
  21. RejectionThe תנא קמא must be רבי שמעון בן אלעזר, so the proof fails
  22. ProofProof from the words of the חכמים in the משנה
  23. ConclusionThe proof is accepted
  24. QuestionWhere do we learn that one tribe is called a קהל?
  25. ResponseFirst source: יהושפט in the קהל of יהודה
  26. QuestionWhat is the 'new' courtyard?
  27. Responseרבי יוחנן: they made a new rule
  28. Challengeרב אחא בר יעקב: ירושלים also belonged to בנימין
  29. ResponseNew source: the promise to יעקב before בנימין's birth
  30. Challengeרב שבא: maybe the קהל means all twelve tribes
  31. Resolutionרב כהנא: eleven tribes are surely a קהל too
  32. QuestionWhy does the פסוק say 'a second bull'?
  33. Response'Second' ties the חטאת to the עולה, so it is not eaten