Gemara Clarity

Kesubos 4a

כתובות ד׳ ע״א

Ketubot 4a

Learn Kesubos 4a step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

Open Kesubos 4a in Gemara Clarity

Topic

A parent's death right before a wedding: the order of חופה, feast days and אבילות; רב חסדא's water-on-the-meat limit; and the couple sleeping apart in mourning and נדה cases

Overview

This עמוד finishes a ברייתא about a parent who died just before a wedding while the food was already prepared. The wedding goes first, then the seven feast days, and then the seven days of אבילות, and the couple sleeps apart the whole time. The גמרא limits this rule to the death of the חתן's father or the כלה's mother. רב חסדא limits it further to when water was already put on the meat. רבא and רב פפא add that a big city and a village each work differently, and רב אשי shows that רב חסדא's rule applies in a middle-sized town like מתא מחסיא. A ברייתא supports רב חסדא and adds rules about a כלה who became a נדה, about jewelry, and about not having the first relations on Friday or Saturday night. The 'sleep apart' line supports רבי יוחנן, who holds that private mourning practices still apply on a Festival. רבא limits the נדה rule to a couple who had not yet been together, and the גמרא debates whether that limit also covers mourning. The last challenge, from the word 'וכן', is answered on the next עמוד.

Opening lines

וּבוֹעֵל בְּעִילַת מִצְוָה וּפוֹרֵשׁ,

And he has the מצוה intercourse and then separates,

וְנוֹהֵג שִׁבְעַת יְמֵי הַמִּשְׁתֶּה,

and he keeps the seven days of the feast,

וְאַחַר כָּךְ נוֹהֵג שִׁבְעַת יְמֵי אֲבֵילוּת.

and afterward he keeps the seven days of mourning.

וְכׇל אוֹתָן הַיָּמִים,

And all those days,

The steps (15)

  1. StatementThe wedding comes first, then the feast, then the mourning
  2. StatementThe couple sleeps apart, but the bride keeps her jewelry
  3. StatementOnly the groom's father or the bride's mother
  4. Statementרב חסדא: only once water was put on the meat
  5. Statementרבא: in a big city the meat can always be sold
  6. Statementרב פפא: in a village the meat can never be sold
  7. ChallengeSo where does רב חסדא's rule ever apply?
  8. Resolutionרב אשי: an in-between town like מתא מחסיא
  9. ProofA ברייתא matching רב חסדא: the wedding goes ahead before the mourning
  10. StatementMore rules from the ברייתא: a נדה bride, jewelry, and Friday and Saturday nights
  11. ProofSleeping apart supports רבי יוחנן: private mourning still applies
  12. Statementרבא limits the נדה rule to a couple who had not yet been together
  13. ChallengeThe mourning case already had relations, yet they sleep apart
  14. Resolutionרבא was only talking about the נדה case
  15. ChallengeBut the ברייתא says 'and likewise'