Kiddushin 74b

קידושין ע״ד ע״ב

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Topic

Several attempts to explain the משנה's 'כל האסורים לבוא בקהל' and רבי יהודה's dissent, ending with רבא's גר עמוני ומואבי reading, followed by a ברייתא on men who make a woman unfit for כהונה

Overview

The גמרא keeps trying to explain the משנה's line that those 'forbidden to enter the קהל' may marry 'זה בזה', and what רבי יהודה disagrees with. First it reads the line as being about people forbidden to כהונה, such as a girl who converted before age three years and a day. Counterexamples knock that reading down. Next, רב נתן בר הושעיא reads it as being about anyone whose daughter a כהן may not marry. Cases of a חלל and of a גר break that reading too. רב נחמן then says the dispute is about a child born from a brother and sister. That is rejected because another משנה already argues that point. Finally, רבא explains that the משנה's permission is about a גר עמוני ומואבי. רבי יהודה forbids only a regular גר from marrying a ממזרת. The amud ends with a ברייתא listing men whose relations make a woman unfit to marry a כהן. רבי יוסי gives a narrower rule, and רבן שמעון בן גמליאל's opinion continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

The steps (20)

1. StatementReading the משנה as referring to the priesthood
2. ChallengeWhy not read it as an older convert so it fits everyone?
3. ResolutionThat reading would make the משנה contradict itself
4. ResolutionExplaining the contradiction
5. ChallengeWomen forbidden to a כהן are not free to marry flawed families
6. ChallengeA גר is permitted to both a כהנת and a ממזרת
7. ResolutionA new reading: whoever's daughter a priest cannot marry
8. ChallengeChallenge from a חלל who married an ordinary Jewish woman
9. ResolutionAnswer: this follows רבי דוסתאי בן יהודה
10. ChallengeChallenge from a חלל who married a חללה
11. ChallengeSecond challenge: the flip side of the rule fails too
12. ResolutionA new explanation: the dispute is about two kinds of ממזר
13. ResolutionSpelling out the two sides of רב נחמן's explanation
14. ChallengeThis was already taught in another משנה
15. Resolutionרבא: the argument is about an עמוני and מואבי convert
16. ChallengeThen what is רבי יהודה forbidding?
17. Resolutionרבי יהודה forbids only a regular convert
18. StatementA ברייתא lists men who make a woman unfit for a כהן
19. Statementרבי יוסי: it depends on whether the man's children are unfit
20. Statementרבן שמעון בן גמליאל begins his opinion