Gemara Clarity

Succah 12b

סוכה י״ב ע״ב

Sukkah 12b

Learn Succah 12b step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

Open Succah 12b in Gemara Clarity

Topic

Which materials are valid סכך: the wording of the bundles and haystack משניות, arrow shafts (זכרים and נקבות), stages of flax, and licorice and wormwood leaves.

Overview

This amud opens in the middle of an answer. The גמרא explains that the bundles משנה says 'אין מסככין' because the problem there is only a rabbinic decree, גזירת אוצר. The haystack משנה says 'אינה סוכה' because that סוכה is invalid even מדאורייתא. Next, רב rules that זכרים arrow shafts are kosher סכך but נקבות arrow shafts are פסול. The גמרא asks 'פשיטא!' on each half and shows that each half teaches something new. Then רבי יוחנן rules on three stages of flax: combed flax is פסול, raw stalks are כשר, and he does not know the law for the middle stage, הושני. רבה בר בר חנה adds that he is not even sure what the word הושני means. Finally, רב יהודה permits licorice and wormwood leaves as סכך, while אביי forbids wormwood. The גמרא begins to give אביי's reason, and the answer continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

דְּאֵין מְסַכְּכִין

[Here, where it says] that one may not roof [with them]

מִשּׁוּם גְּזֵרַת אוֹצָר,

it is because of the decree of the storehouse;

הָא דְּאוֹרָיְיתָא שַׁפִּיר דָּמֵי.

but by Torah law it is fine.

הָתָם דְּקָתָנֵי ״אֵינָהּ סוּכָּה״

There, where it teaches 'it is not a sukka,'

The steps (11)

  1. ResolutionDifferent wording because one problem is rabbinic and the other is from the Torah
  2. Statementרב's ruling on roofing with arrow shafts
  3. ChallengeWhy say the male shafts are kosher? That is obvious
  4. ResolutionWe might have banned male shafts because of female ones
  5. ChallengeWhy say the female shafts are invalid? That is also obvious
  6. ResolutionA hollow that is filled permanently still counts as a hollow
  7. StatementThree stages of flax as סכך
  8. QuestionWhat exactly does the word הושני mean?
  9. StatementLicorice and wormwood leaves may be used as סכך
  10. Statementאביי disagrees about wormwood
  11. QuestionWhy does אביי forbid wormwood?