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Chullin 74b

חולין ע״ד ע״ב

Learn Chullin 74b step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

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Topic

The בן פקועה (live fetus in a slaughtered animal): the limits of its leniency, its blood, using it to redeem a firstborn donkey, and whether it is one body with its mother for טומאה.

Overview

The amud opens with the end of the משנה. רבי שמעון שזורי says that a live fetus is permitted by its mother's שחיטה even after it grows up, but if the mother was torn instead of slaughtered, the fetus needs its own שחיטה. In the גמרא, רבי אושעיא limits the חכמים' leniency. A first version says it excludes the fetus's חלב and גיד הנשה, but both are disputed between רבי מאיר and רבי יהודה. So the teaching is restated: the leniency covers only eating, and it leaves out רביעה and plowing with another species. ריש לקיש and רבי יוחנן then argue whether the fetus's blood follows its fat. Through רבי זירא and רב יוסף, this becomes a question of whether the blood carries כרת. Next the גמרא asks whether a בן פקועה can be used to redeem a firstborn donkey. מר זוטרא says no and רב אשי says yes, and they debate the גזירה שוה of "שה" from the פסח. Finally, רבי יוחנן and ריש לקיש argue whether the fetus is a separate body or one body with its mother for טומאה, and each challenges the other from sources about what makes the fetus ready to receive טומאה.

Opening lines

רַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן שֵׁזוּרִי אוֹמֵר:

Rabbi Shimon Shezuri says:

אֲפִילּוּ בֶּן חָמֵשׁ שָׁנִים

Even if it is five years old

וְחוֹרֵשׁ בַּשָּׂדֶה –

and plowing in the field,

שְׁחִיטַת אִמּוֹ מְטַהַרְתּוֹ.

the slaughter of its mother makes it permitted.

The steps (30)

  1. StatementEven a grown animal is permitted by its mother's slaughter
  2. StatementIf the mother was torn, not slaughtered, the fetus needs its own slaughter
  3. StatementThe leniency applies only to the matter of slaughter
  4. QuestionWhat does this limitation exclude?
  5. ResponseIt excludes the forbidden fat and the sciatic nerve
  6. QuestionWhich fat is meant?
  7. ChallengeThe fetus's own fat cannot be meant, because it is disputed
  8. ChallengeThe fat of the nerve cannot be meant either, because it is also disputed
  9. ResolutionRabbi Oshaya's teaching restated: only about eating
  10. StatementDispute: does the fetus's blood follow its fat?
  11. Challengeרבי יוחנן challenges from the משנה: tear it and remove its blood
  12. Resolutionרבי זירא: ריש לקיש only meant there is no כרת
  13. ChallengeBut רבי יהודה gives כרת even for דם התמצית
  14. ResolutionLifeblood and draining blood go together for רבי יהודה
  15. QuestionCan a בן פקועה be used to redeem a firstborn donkey?
  16. QuestionAccording to the רבנן: plain meat or a living lamb?
  17. Responseמר זוטרא and רב אשי disagree
  18. Questionרב אשי asks מר זוטרא for his reason
  19. ChallengeThen the lamb should also need to be male, unblemished and one year old
  20. ResolutionThe doubled word "redeem" widens the rule
  21. ChallengeThen include every kind of lamb
  22. ResolutionOtherwise the link of "lamb" would teach nothing
  23. QuestionDoes the fetus count as a separate level of impurity?
  24. ResponseThe fetus counts as a separate level of טומאה
  25. ResponseThe fetus is like a nut inside its shell
  26. Challengeריש לקיש quotes the משנה about the fetus's foreleg
  27. ChallengeHow did the fetus become ready to get טומאה?
  28. ResolutionThe slaughter itself made the fetus ready, following רבי שמעון
  29. Challengeרבי יוחנן quotes a ברייתא about a בן פקועה crossing a river
  30. ChallengeWhy would it need the river if its mother's blood already made it ready?