Menachos 47b

מנחות מ״ז ע״ב

Menachot 47b

Learn Menachos 47b step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

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Topic

How far a זריקה reaches loaves that left the עזרה, and whether the lambs of עצרת can be sprinkled שלא לשמן once their loaves are lost

Overview

The amud opens with a משנה from מסכת מעילה. There רבי אליעזר says the זריקה does nothing for sacrificial parts that left the עזרה, while רבי עקיבא says it still takes effect. Building on רבי עקיבא, the גמרא asks about the loaves of עצרת. Since a פיגול זריקה makes loaves that left into פיגול, does a זריקה שלא לשמה also permit them, or does this work only to be strict? רב פפא questions the premise. Maybe everyone agrees that זריקה does nothing for loaves still outside, and the argument is only about loaves brought back in, depending on whether שחיטה makes the loaves holy. The גמרא tries to reject his reading using רב גידל's rule that a פיגול זריקה has no effect on מעילה. But that rule was already refuted, so רב פפא's reading stands. Next, רבי ירמיה asks רבי זירא about lambs of עצרת whose loaves were lost after the שחיטה: may their blood be sprinkled שלא לשמן to permit the meat? רבי זירא says no, and narrows his rule twice to answer challenges from the פסח. He then turns aside the challenge from a תודה, since the Torah calls a תודה שלמים. The amud ends as a ברייתא begins about two lambs slaughtered with four loaves, and it continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

The steps (20)

1. ProofThe משנה in מעילה: רבי אליעזר's view on portions that left before the sprinkling
2. Statementרבי עקיבא's view: the sprinkling still takes effect
3. QuestionThe dilemma: if a פיגול sprinkling affects the loaves, does a שלא לשמה sprinkling permit them?
4. QuestionSecond side: maybe we apply it only to be strict, not to be lenient
5. Challengeרב פפא questions the assumed case of the dispute
6. Challengeרב פפא's alternative reading of the dispute
7. Rejectionרבי עקיבא's words fit only if slaughter makes the loaves holy
8. RejectionIf רבי עקיבא held like רבי אלעזר ברבי שמעון, a פיגול זריקה could not make the loaves holy
9. Proofרב: a פיגול זריקה neither brings items into מעילה nor takes them out
10. StatementExplaining the two halves of רב's rule
11. RejectionThe proof from רב גידל does not stand
12. QuestionSheep slaughtered for their sake, then the loaves were lost
13. ResponseNothing is unfit for its sake yet fit not for its sake
14. ChallengeChallenge from a פסח before midday
15. ResolutionOnce fit, then pushed off
16. ChallengeA פסח after its time
17. Resolutionרבי זירא adds: already slaughtered for its own sake
18. ChallengeThe תודה whose loaves broke
19. ResolutionA תודה is called שלמים
20. StatementTwo sheep slaughtered with four loaves