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Menachos 82a

מנחות פ״ב ע״א

Menachot 82a

Learn Menachos 82a step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

Open Menachos 82a in Gemara Clarity

Topic

Using מעשר שני money for offerings: תודה loaves, designating the money for שלמים, and the rule that obligatory offerings come only from חולין

Overview

The amud opens by finishing a debate about whether the loaves of a תודה may be made from wheat bought with מעשר שני money. The answer is no: the תודה is learned from שלמים, and שלמים are not the same kind of thing as מעשר, while wheat is. Next, רבי אמי rules that מעשר שני money designated for שלמים does not become שלמים. A challenge from a משנה about the hide of an animal bought with מעשר money is answered by רב and רבה. Then רבי יוחנן and רבי אלעזר disagree on the same question. The גמרא explains that their dispute depends on whether מעשר belongs to its owner (רבי יהודה) or to Heaven (רבי מאיר). A new משנה teaches that any obligatory offering, including a vowed תודה or שלמים, must come from חולין, learned from the פסח. The גמרא brings רבי אליעזר's proof that פסח itself comes from חולין, based on the פסח in מצרים. רבי עקיבא challenges that proof twice, and his second argument continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

וּשְׁלָמִים ״שָׁם״ ״שָׁם״ מִמַּעֲשֵׂר.

And peace offerings are learned through "there" and "there" from tithe.

וּמִינַּהּ:

And from this we can conclude:

מָה שְׁלָמִים אֵין גּוּפָן מַעֲשֵׂר –

Just as peace offerings are not themselves tithe,

אַף תּוֹדָה נָמֵי אֵין גּוּפָהּ מַעֲשֵׂר,

so too a thanks offering is also not itself tithe,

The steps (19)

  1. ChallengeIf peace offerings are not tithe themselves, the wheat should be allowed
  2. ResolutionThe comparison is about species, and wheat is the species of tithe
  3. StatementSecond-tithe money designated for a peace offering does not become a peace offering
  4. ChallengeChallenge from the hide of an animal bought with tithe money
  5. Resolutionרב explains the משנה: the hide never became שלמים
  6. QuestionWhy doesn't the animal become anything holy?
  7. Responseרבה: like buying an ox for plowing
  8. Statementרבי יוחנן and רבי אלעזר disagree
  9. StatementThe dispute exists only according to רבי מאיר
  10. StatementThe reasoning of each side
  11. ChallengeA ברייתא requires two fifths when redeeming
  12. ResolutionThe ברייתא follows רבי יהודה
  13. StatementObligatory offerings must come from חולין, learned from פסח
  14. StatementApplying the rule to vowed תודה, שלמים, and נסכים
  15. QuestionHow do we know פסח itself comes from חולין?
  16. ResponseThe פסח in מצרים teaches the פסח for later generations
  17. Challengeרבי עקיבא: You can't learn a choice from a case with no choice
  18. Resolutionרבי אליעזר: It is still a strong proof
  19. Challengeרבי עקיבא's second attack: the Egypt פסח was different