Gemara Clarity

Niddah 24b

נדה כ״ד ע״ב

Learn Niddah 24b step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

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Topic

Unusual births and miscarriages: the two-backed child, animals born early, fetuses shaped like a לילית or a snake, and a miscarried sac, followed by אבא שאול's stories about giant bones.

Overview

The amud opens by finishing the argument between רב and שמואל about a creature with two backs and two spines. שמואל reads a ברייתא about animals to fit his view, and רב adds the two-backed child to a ברייתא that says only a baby fit for a ברית on the eighth day brings טומאת לידה. רב הונא rules that in practice we follow רב, because the הלכה follows רב in איסורים. Next, רבא asks whether a large animal can give birth to a living calf at seven months, like a woman. A proof is suggested and then pushed off, and the question stays unproven. Then come rulings and a story about miscarried fetuses shaped like a לילית or a snake, ending with אביי's lesson that a scholar should always give the reason for his ruling. A new משנה follows about a miscarried sac, and the גמרא gives three answers for why a sac of colors is not a dissolved child. Finally, אבא שאול's gravedigger stories about huge bones lead into a chain of each generation's tallest man, which continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

וּשְׁמוּאֵל מְתָרֵץ לְטַעְמֵיהּ:

And Shmuel explains it according to his reasoning:

בֶּן אַרְבָּעָה לְדַקָּה,

born in the fourth month, for small animals,

בֶּן שְׁמֹנֶה לְגַסָּה —

born in the eighth month, for large animals —

הֵימֶנּוּ וּלְמַטָּה אָסוּר.

from that point and earlier, it is forbidden.

The steps (29)

  1. Resolutionשמואל reads the animal ברייתא to fit his view
  2. StatementA ברייתא: a shapeless miscarriage does not make the mother impure from birth
  3. Statementרב adds the two-backed child to the ברייתא
  4. Statementרבי ירמיה בר אבא wants to rule like שמואל
  5. Challengeרב הונא: being strict here leads to a leniency
  6. ConclusionThe הלכה follows רב in prohibitions
  7. Questionרבא asks whether a large animal can give birth after seven months
  8. Proofרב נחמן בר יצחק brings a proof from a ברייתא
  9. RejectionThe proof is pushed off: the ברייתא may be about small animals
  10. ChallengeChallenging the pushback: about small animals the ruling would be obvious
  11. ResolutionThe ruling about small animals is needed after all
  12. StatementA fetus shaped like a לילית counts as a birth
  13. ProofA ברייתא supports שמואל with a real case
  14. Statementחנינא rules about a snake-shaped fetus and is summoned
  15. QuestionOn the way, חנינא's daughter-in-law asks רבי יהושע
  16. ChallengeShe reminds him that he once said the opposite
  17. Conclusionרבי יהושע remembers and defends חנינא
  18. Conclusionאביי's lesson: always give the reason for your ruling
  19. Statementמשנה: a sac with fluid, a formed sac, a sandal, or an afterbirth
  20. ChallengeWhy not worry that a child dissolved in the colored sac?
  21. Resolutionאביי: fetuses don't just dissolve
  22. Resolutionרבא: the sac is full, so nothing dissolved
  23. Resolutionרב אדא בר אהבה: many colors, so nothing dissolved
  24. StatementWhat bones reveal about drinking and eating
  25. StatementRunning inside the giant thighbone of עוג
  26. StatementStanding inside the eye socket of אבשלום
  27. ChallengeMaybe אבא שאול was just very short?
  28. Resolutionאבא שאול was the tallest man of his generation
  29. ResolutionThe height chain continues from רבי חייא down to אדא דיילא