Gemara Clarity

Zevachim 83b

זבחים פ״ג ע״ב

Learn Zevachim 83b step by step: Aramaic beside English, every question, answer and proof colour-coded.

Open Zevachim 83b in Gemara Clarity

Topic

Which items stay on the מזבח once they go up, and the פסוקים each תנא uses to learn it

Overview

The גמרא begins with the משנה's rule that the מזבח keeps only items 'suited to it.' רב פפא says this leaves out a קמיצה that was never placed in a כלי שרת, because it is still missing an action on itself. Next, the גמרא works through how רבי יהושע and רבן גמליאל each read the words 'עֹלָה עַל מוֹקְדָה עַל הַמִּזְבֵּחַ.' Along the way it learns the rules about putting back pieces that fell off the fire, and why burnt קטורת is not put back. It also explains why רבי יהושע needs two 'מזבח' פסוקים and רבן גמליאל does not. Then a ברייתא gives רבי שמעון's source: only items that come for their own sake stay up, so נסכים come down. Another ברייתא has רבי יוסי הגלילי learning the rule from 'כבשים' and רבי עקיבא learning it from 'עולה.' They differ over a disqualified bird עולה, and between them they leave out a מנחה. רב פפא shows that this puts them against the תנאים of our משנה on disqualified קמצים. ריש לקיש then begins a summary, which continues on the next amud.

Opening lines

גְּמָ׳

Gemara:

רָאוּי לוֹ אִין,

Things suited to it [the altar], yes,

שֶׁאֵין רָאוּי לוֹ לָא;

things not suited to it, no;

לְמַעוֹטֵי מַאי?

to exclude what?

The steps (30)

  1. QuestionWhat does 'suited to it' leave out?
  2. ResponseA handful of flour not yet placed in a holy vessel
  3. Challengeרבינא challenges from עולא's ruling
  4. ResolutionMissing an action on itself versus waiting for a separate action
  5. ChallengeWhy doesn't רבן גמליאל learn from 'עֹלָה עַל מוֹקְדָה'?
  6. ResolutionThe פסוק teaches returning pieces that fell off
  7. ChallengeWhere does רבי יהושע learn to return pieces that jumped off the fire?
  8. Resolutionרבי יהושע learns it from 'that the fire consumes'
  9. QuestionWhat does רבן גמליאל do with 'that the fire consumes'?
  10. ResponseBurnt pieces of an עולה go back, but burnt pieces of קטורת do not
  11. QuestionWhere does רבי יהושע learn the incense rule?
  12. ResponseThe incense limit comes on its own from the word 'עולה'
  13. StatementQuoting the משנה: רבן גמליאל says anything fit for the מזבח stays up
  14. Challengeרבי יהושע also has the word 'מזבח' in the פסוק
  15. Resolution'מזבח' teaches the reason: the altar makes things holy
  16. ResponseWhere רבן גמליאל learns that the altar makes things holy
  17. ResolutionWhy רבי יהושע needs both altar verses
  18. ResolutionWhy רבן גמליאל does not need a separate verse for each case
  19. Statementרבי שמעון: only things that come for their own sake stay on the altar
  20. Statementרבי יוסי הגלילי: the מזבח only makes fit items holy, learned from 'כבשים'
  21. Statementרבי עקיבא: the same limit, learned from 'burnt offering'
  22. QuestionWhat is the practical difference between the two sources?
  23. ResponseThey differ about a disqualified bird burnt offering
  24. ChallengeBut the word 'עולה' is also written
  25. Resolution'עולה' teaches that live animals are not included
  26. ChallengeBut the word 'כבשים' is also written
  27. Resolution'כבשים' teaches that a מנחה is not included
  28. QuestionHow do these תנאים differ from the תנאים of our משנה?
  29. ResponseThey differ about קמצים that became holy in a כלי
  30. StatementBy all the משנה's opinions, a meal offering that comes by itself does not come down